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Developing resistance

Started by jmoorhou , Dec 06 2017 12:09 PM

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#1 jmoorhou

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 12:09 PM

After 4 months at 200 mg gleevec my wbc count went from 7.3 to 9.4, now after four months at 300 mg, wbc is up to 10.1...am I getting resistant?
Diagnosed 3/2014 WBC 28 Non detectable within 3 monthsGleevec 400 mg 5/2014 one hour after dinner really improves nausea300 mg 12/15/2016200 mg and 300 mg Gleevec 2/25/2017 (after 3 years on Gleevec) For last four months taking 300 mg per day. Last CMC showed liver enzymes elevated, went to a good Naturopath and he recommended 4 Tumeric, 10,000 mg Vitamen D, and 3 milk thistle (silymarin) daily. Also use One<p>Day Detox Dandeloin tea, and Nettle Tea and a slice of ginger every day...in two months liver tests were below normal.Janis

#2 Buzzm1

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 12:27 PM

When did you first lose your undetected status?  How often are you testing?


For the benefit of yourself and others please add your CML history into your Signature

 

02/2010 Gleevec 400mg

2011 Two weakly positives, PCRU, weakly positive

2012 PCRU, PCRU, PCRU, PCRU

2013 PCRU, PCRU, PCRU, weakly positive

2014 PCRU, PCRU, PCRU, PCRU (12/07 began dose reduction w/each continuing PCRU)

2015 300, 250, 200, 150

2016 100, 50/100, 100, 10/17 TFR

2017 01/17 TFR, 04/18 TFR, 07/18 TFR 0.0012, 08/29 TFR 0.001, 10/17 TFR 0.000

2018 01/16 TFR 0.0004 ... next quarterly PCR 04/17

 

At the earliest opportunity, and whenever possible, lower your TKI dosage; TKIs are toxic drugs and the less we take longterm the better off we are going to be ... this is especially true for older adults.  

 

In hindsight I should have started my dosage reduction two years earlier; it might have helped minimize some of the longterm cumulative toxic effects of TKIs that I am beset with.  

 

longterm side-effects Peripheral Artery Disease - legs (it's a bitch); continuing shoulder problems, right elbow inflammation.   GFR and creatinine vastly improved after stopping Gleevec.

 

Cumulative Gleevec dosage estimated at 830 grams

 

Taking Gleevec 400mg an hour after my largest meal of the day helped eliminate the nausea that Gleevec is notorious for.  

 

Trey's CML Blog - Stopping - The Odds - Stop Studies - Discussion Forum Cessation Study

Big PhRMA - Medicare Status - Social Security Status - Deficit/Debt

#3 thatguy

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 12:30 PM

Did you get a pcr test?
3/25/2015- Dx'ed by FISH : 85% of cells dual-fusion signals, 7% with tri-fusion signals, WBC 212,000. Started Gleevec 400mg.... Calculated .93 SOKAL

08/17/2015- 14.793 % I.S P210 (quest)
10/15/2015- 3.313 % I.S (quest)
12/23/2015- 1.891 % I.S (quest)
1/07/2016- Tasigna 300mg 2x daily
1/14/2016- 4.414 % I.S P210- City Of Hope lab, mutation negative.
1/26/2016- 1.589 % I.S (quest)
2/22/2016- 1.719 % I.S (quest)
2/29/2016- 1.133 % I.S (quest)
3/03/2016- Tasigna 400mg 2x daily.
3/29/2016- 0.663 % I.S (quest)
4/27/2016- 0.781 % I.S (quest)
5/04/2016- 0.652 % I.S.(quest)
5/24/2016- 0.501 % I.S (quest)
6/28/2016-0.534 % I.S (quest)
7/15/2016-0.881 % I.S (quest)
7/22/2016- Bosulif 500mg
7/28/2016- t315i test- Negative
8/22/2016-0.432 % I.S (quest )
11/15/2016-0.325 % I.S (quest)
2/1/2017- .0445% i.s (genoptix)
5/6/2017- .0968% i.s (genoptix)
5/12/2017- .12 % i.s (quest).
6/4/2017- .083% i.s (quest)
6/11/2017- .0295% i.s (genoptix)
8/5/2017- .0501% i.s (genoptix)
11/6/2017- .0270% i.s (genoptix)

#4 jmoorhou

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 12:40 PM

I don't have the bar/abl test yet...
Diagnosed 3/2014 WBC 28 Non detectable within 3 monthsGleevec 400 mg 5/2014 one hour after dinner really improves nausea300 mg 12/15/2016200 mg and 300 mg Gleevec 2/25/2017 (after 3 years on Gleevec) For last four months taking 300 mg per day. Last CMC showed liver enzymes elevated, went to a good Naturopath and he recommended 4 Tumeric, 10,000 mg Vitamen D, and 3 milk thistle (silymarin) daily. Also use One<p>Day Detox Dandeloin tea, and Nettle Tea and a slice of ginger every day...in two months liver tests were below normal.Janis

#5 thatguy

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 12:45 PM

Probably just cold season working on your body. 10.1 is still normal. I think your pcr has to elevate before wbc will. Did you have a diff? What kinds of 'cyte numbers did you have?
3/25/2015- Dx'ed by FISH : 85% of cells dual-fusion signals, 7% with tri-fusion signals, WBC 212,000. Started Gleevec 400mg.... Calculated .93 SOKAL

08/17/2015- 14.793 % I.S P210 (quest)
10/15/2015- 3.313 % I.S (quest)
12/23/2015- 1.891 % I.S (quest)
1/07/2016- Tasigna 300mg 2x daily
1/14/2016- 4.414 % I.S P210- City Of Hope lab, mutation negative.
1/26/2016- 1.589 % I.S (quest)
2/22/2016- 1.719 % I.S (quest)
2/29/2016- 1.133 % I.S (quest)
3/03/2016- Tasigna 400mg 2x daily.
3/29/2016- 0.663 % I.S (quest)
4/27/2016- 0.781 % I.S (quest)
5/04/2016- 0.652 % I.S.(quest)
5/24/2016- 0.501 % I.S (quest)
6/28/2016-0.534 % I.S (quest)
7/15/2016-0.881 % I.S (quest)
7/22/2016- Bosulif 500mg
7/28/2016- t315i test- Negative
8/22/2016-0.432 % I.S (quest )
11/15/2016-0.325 % I.S (quest)
2/1/2017- .0445% i.s (genoptix)
5/6/2017- .0968% i.s (genoptix)
5/12/2017- .12 % i.s (quest).
6/4/2017- .083% i.s (quest)
6/11/2017- .0295% i.s (genoptix)
8/5/2017- .0501% i.s (genoptix)
11/6/2017- .0270% i.s (genoptix)

#6 scuba

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 12:46 PM

You should be receiving PCR blood tests. 

 

PCR would have to get to near 100% and FISH over 50% before you would see elevated WBC's again (due to CML).


Diagnosed 11 May 2011 (100% FiSH, 155% PCR)

with b2a2 BCR-ABL fusion transcript coding for the 210kDa BCR-ABL protein

 

Sprycel: 20 mg per day - taken at lights out with Quercetin and/or Magnesium Taurate

6-8 grams Curcumin C3 complex.

 

2015 PCR: < 0.01% (M.D. Anderson scale)

2016 PCR: < 0.01% (M.D. Anderson scale) 

March        2017 PCR:     0.01% (M.D. Anderson scale)

June          2017 PCR:     "undetected"

September 2017 PCR:     "undetected"

#7 Buzzm1

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 12:48 PM

Your wbc count is well within normal .... you are making mountains out of molehills ...


For the benefit of yourself and others please add your CML history into your Signature

 

02/2010 Gleevec 400mg

2011 Two weakly positives, PCRU, weakly positive

2012 PCRU, PCRU, PCRU, PCRU

2013 PCRU, PCRU, PCRU, weakly positive

2014 PCRU, PCRU, PCRU, PCRU (12/07 began dose reduction w/each continuing PCRU)

2015 300, 250, 200, 150

2016 100, 50/100, 100, 10/17 TFR

2017 01/17 TFR, 04/18 TFR, 07/18 TFR 0.0012, 08/29 TFR 0.001, 10/17 TFR 0.000

2018 01/16 TFR 0.0004 ... next quarterly PCR 04/17

 

At the earliest opportunity, and whenever possible, lower your TKI dosage; TKIs are toxic drugs and the less we take longterm the better off we are going to be ... this is especially true for older adults.  

 

In hindsight I should have started my dosage reduction two years earlier; it might have helped minimize some of the longterm cumulative toxic effects of TKIs that I am beset with.  

 

longterm side-effects Peripheral Artery Disease - legs (it's a bitch); continuing shoulder problems, right elbow inflammation.   GFR and creatinine vastly improved after stopping Gleevec.

 

Cumulative Gleevec dosage estimated at 830 grams

 

Taking Gleevec 400mg an hour after my largest meal of the day helped eliminate the nausea that Gleevec is notorious for.  

 

Trey's CML Blog - Stopping - The Odds - Stop Studies - Discussion Forum Cessation Study

Big PhRMA - Medicare Status - Social Security Status - Deficit/Debt

#8 jmoorhou

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 01:47 PM

Thanks guys..hope you are right, I'm going back to 400 gleevec.
Diagnosed 3/2014 WBC 28 Non detectable within 3 monthsGleevec 400 mg 5/2014 one hour after dinner really improves nausea300 mg 12/15/2016200 mg and 300 mg Gleevec 2/25/2017 (after 3 years on Gleevec) For last four months taking 300 mg per day. Last CMC showed liver enzymes elevated, went to a good Naturopath and he recommended 4 Tumeric, 10,000 mg Vitamen D, and 3 milk thistle (silymarin) daily. Also use One<p>Day Detox Dandeloin tea, and Nettle Tea and a slice of ginger every day...in two months liver tests were below normal.Janis

#9 Buzzm1

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 01:53 PM

If you haven't lost undetected status why would you go back to 400mg after being successful on 200mg?


For the benefit of yourself and others please add your CML history into your Signature

 

02/2010 Gleevec 400mg

2011 Two weakly positives, PCRU, weakly positive

2012 PCRU, PCRU, PCRU, PCRU

2013 PCRU, PCRU, PCRU, weakly positive

2014 PCRU, PCRU, PCRU, PCRU (12/07 began dose reduction w/each continuing PCRU)

2015 300, 250, 200, 150

2016 100, 50/100, 100, 10/17 TFR

2017 01/17 TFR, 04/18 TFR, 07/18 TFR 0.0012, 08/29 TFR 0.001, 10/17 TFR 0.000

2018 01/16 TFR 0.0004 ... next quarterly PCR 04/17

 

At the earliest opportunity, and whenever possible, lower your TKI dosage; TKIs are toxic drugs and the less we take longterm the better off we are going to be ... this is especially true for older adults.  

 

In hindsight I should have started my dosage reduction two years earlier; it might have helped minimize some of the longterm cumulative toxic effects of TKIs that I am beset with.  

 

longterm side-effects Peripheral Artery Disease - legs (it's a bitch); continuing shoulder problems, right elbow inflammation.   GFR and creatinine vastly improved after stopping Gleevec.

 

Cumulative Gleevec dosage estimated at 830 grams

 

Taking Gleevec 400mg an hour after my largest meal of the day helped eliminate the nausea that Gleevec is notorious for.  

 

Trey's CML Blog - Stopping - The Odds - Stop Studies - Discussion Forum Cessation Study

Big PhRMA - Medicare Status - Social Security Status - Deficit/Debt

#10 carrie

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 02:52 PM

I was on 400 gleevec daily for 10 years.

My PCR/ABL bloodwork is listed below.

I went up and up and even had mutation tests run.

When I hit 14. I stopped Gleevec. Most likely a resistance. 

See below.


Diagnosed   2007

On Gleevec for 10 years

Results from 2007-2012 not shown below

International Scale from 2012 until now

Never went to 0

0.166

0.038

1.155

0.789

0.104

0.099

0.701

1.986

1.063

1.799

2.817

1.832

3.449

1.050

1.438

3.376

3.370

3.370

2.580

8.990

4.250

6.176

14.109   Changing to Tasigna 7/7/17

 

7/28/17  800 mgs Tasigna

10/5/17  600 mgs Tasigna (Lots of bad side effects)

10/16/2017    PCR down to 0.141  

1/15/18          PCR down to  0.066   Dose reduction again. Now 400 mgs daily.

#11 carrie

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 02:53 PM

Why isn't your doctor having you do PCR bloodwork every 3 months?


Diagnosed   2007

On Gleevec for 10 years

Results from 2007-2012 not shown below

International Scale from 2012 until now

Never went to 0

0.166

0.038

1.155

0.789

0.104

0.099

0.701

1.986

1.063

1.799

2.817

1.832

3.449

1.050

1.438

3.376

3.370

3.370

2.580

8.990

4.250

6.176

14.109   Changing to Tasigna 7/7/17

 

7/28/17  800 mgs Tasigna

10/5/17  600 mgs Tasigna (Lots of bad side effects)

10/16/2017    PCR down to 0.141  

1/15/18          PCR down to  0.066   Dose reduction again. Now 400 mgs daily.

#12 jmoorhou

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 09:19 PM

I do blood work every four months. 6 mos ago bar/abl went from .0007 to .007. Will have results for this test couple of weeks. What it probably is I am less myelosuppresed from 300 mg.....gleevec.....hope so...back to 400 at least every other night. ...where are the emojis.....

Just checked neutrophils...they are going up also....that's good.
Diagnosed 3/2014 WBC 28 Non detectable within 3 monthsGleevec 400 mg 5/2014 one hour after dinner really improves nausea300 mg 12/15/2016200 mg and 300 mg Gleevec 2/25/2017 (after 3 years on Gleevec) For last four months taking 300 mg per day. Last CMC showed liver enzymes elevated, went to a good Naturopath and he recommended 4 Tumeric, 10,000 mg Vitamen D, and 3 milk thistle (silymarin) daily. Also use One<p>Day Detox Dandeloin tea, and Nettle Tea and a slice of ginger every day...in two months liver tests were below normal.Janis
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